Comments on: Wanting Better Closure http://ludusnovus.net/2009/01/25/wanting-better-closure/ The Art of Interaction Tue, 07 Sep 2010 17:50:20 +0000 hourly 1 By: Phillip Meiser http://ludusnovus.net/2009/01/25/wanting-better-closure/comment-page-1/#comment-36303 Phillip Meiser Thu, 05 Feb 2009 03:28:33 +0000 http://ludusnovus.net/?p=297#comment-36303 I actually did not have an issue with jumps coming up short or "gummyness" on the jumping. Sometimes I had to use a bit of care exactly where I dropped my orbs, but mostly the controls were smooth and did what I wanted them to. The few times they didn't were mostly a result of me expecting to be able to pull the highly unrealistic fall direction control Mario taught me. I did run into some issues jumping off of wall segments with a steep angle on them. I expect it was because they run into the old platformer problem where you can't jump if you are falling, which was aggravated by the light flicker, but it only happened on a couple levels. The timing on some of the moving puzzles was tight, but I didn't think it was unreasonably so. I am not that great at jumping puzzles, so if something looked barely possible, I usually found a more forgiving approach with a bit of fiddling. That said, this game was still deviously hard at times, but the challenge was mostly from puzzle elements and orb management. Oh, and a lot of deaths from those stupid dark orbs. I feel like they could have been made to look a little more different. I actually did not have an issue with jumps coming up short or “gummyness” on the jumping. Sometimes I had to use a bit of care exactly where I dropped my orbs, but mostly the controls were smooth and did what I wanted them to. The few times they didn’t were mostly a result of me expecting to be able to pull the highly unrealistic fall direction control Mario taught me. I did run into some issues jumping off of wall segments with a steep angle on them. I expect it was because they run into the old platformer problem where you can’t jump if you are falling, which was aggravated by the light flicker, but it only happened on a couple levels. The timing on some of the moving puzzles was tight, but I didn’t think it was unreasonably so. I am not that great at jumping puzzles, so if something looked barely possible, I usually found a more forgiving approach with a bit of fiddling.

That said, this game was still deviously hard at times, but the challenge was mostly from puzzle elements and orb management. Oh, and a lot of deaths from those stupid dark orbs. I feel like they could have been made to look a little more different.

]]> By: Kevin Wallace http://ludusnovus.net/2009/01/25/wanting-better-closure/comment-page-1/#comment-35993 Kevin Wallace Thu, 29 Jan 2009 19:41:49 +0000 http://ludusnovus.net/?p=297#comment-35993 To elaborate more after playing Closure through fully: The "Dark Orbs" actually illuminate more the further you are from them, capping out at a *higher* light level than the light ones. I actually used that as a trick to activate light orbs on a couple levels, and to activate the final door in the game without going through a tedious amount of timed jumping. To elaborate more after playing Closure through fully: The “Dark Orbs” actually illuminate more the further you are from them, capping out at a *higher* light level than the light ones. I actually used that as a trick to activate light orbs on a couple levels, and to activate the final door in the game without going through a tedious amount of timed jumping.

]]> By: Gregory Weir http://ludusnovus.net/2009/01/25/wanting-better-closure/comment-page-1/#comment-35804 Gregory Weir Tue, 27 Jan 2009 05:47:49 +0000 http://ludusnovus.net/?p=297#comment-35804 Regarding the dimming: there are two kinds of ball, a light ball and a "dark ball." The dark balls dim when the player gets too close. They do, however, provide enough light to activate a dormant light ball. It may have been my own ineptness that gave me trouble, but I often felt that my jumps were just a pixel or two short. Just increasing jumping range by ten pixels would have made my experience a lot smoother. Regarding the dimming: there are two kinds of ball, a light ball and a “dark ball.” The dark balls dim when the player gets too close. They do, however, provide enough light to activate a dormant light ball.

It may have been my own ineptness that gave me trouble, but I often felt that my jumps were just a pixel or two short. Just increasing jumping range by ten pixels would have made my experience a lot smoother.

]]> By: Richard Terrell (KirbyKid) http://ludusnovus.net/2009/01/25/wanting-better-closure/comment-page-1/#comment-35800 Richard Terrell (KirbyKid) Tue, 27 Jan 2009 04:51:53 +0000 http://ludusnovus.net/?p=297#comment-35800 Thanks for the glowing reference. I played a little Closure just now, and I think I understand where you're coming from. Closure is a lot like Braid. It's a puzzle game that uses 2D side scrolling platforming mechanics as a base/foundation. Where Braid is all about manipulating time and space, Closure is about manipulating space/matter/and light. I ran into some of the frustrating experiences you described when I was playing Closure like a platforming game. I was cutting the timing really closely and trying to make crazy jumps. But, like Jonathan Blow would say, there's an elegant solution to it. For closure, the elegant solutions are ones that don't involve tricky, carefully timed maneuvers (at least from what I've played). The collision detection could be a little cleaner, true. I know that may be asking a lot from the developers considering the tech and reconciling the supernatural mechanic of creating matter only where one can see it. For the record, Super Mario Galaxy beat closure to the punch with its Matter Scatter level. I think that the jump speed and distance suit the game. Each of the puzzles I've played fit within the screen size. All of the intricacies in solving each puzzle happens in the space of a few steps (of the character). Having a bigger jump wouldn't positively affect the game play considering that the gameplay only exists in small areas at at time as opposed to huge sweeping obstacles/gaps to overcome. I'm confused as to why the lighted areas I jump into dim and thus drop me to my doom. There's something strange about jumping over a lamp/light ball that I don't understand yet. I'll play more and think more. Thanks for the glowing reference.

I played a little Closure just now, and I think I understand where you’re coming from.

Closure is a lot like Braid. It’s a puzzle game that uses 2D side scrolling platforming mechanics as a base/foundation. Where Braid is all about manipulating time and space, Closure is about manipulating space/matter/and light.

I ran into some of the frustrating experiences you described when I was playing Closure like a platforming game. I was cutting the timing really closely and trying to make crazy jumps. But, like Jonathan Blow would say, there’s an elegant solution to it. For closure, the elegant solutions are ones that don’t involve tricky, carefully timed maneuvers (at least from what I’ve played).

The collision detection could be a little cleaner, true. I know that may be asking a lot from the developers considering the tech and reconciling the supernatural mechanic of creating matter only where one can see it. For the record, Super Mario Galaxy beat closure to the punch with its Matter Scatter level.

I think that the jump speed and distance suit the game. Each of the puzzles I’ve played fit within the screen size. All of the intricacies in solving each puzzle happens in the space of a few steps (of the character). Having a bigger jump wouldn’t positively affect the game play considering that the gameplay only exists in small areas at at time as opposed to huge sweeping obstacles/gaps to overcome.

I’m confused as to why the lighted areas I jump into dim and thus drop me to my doom. There’s something strange about jumping over a lamp/light ball that I don’t understand yet.

I’ll play more and think more.

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